Fratello On Air: Discussing Our Picks Under €5,000 And How The Industry Has Changed

Open talk about finding value under the magic threshold

October 18, 2023

comments 14

Welcome to another episode of Fratello On Air where we discuss our recent picks of the best watches under €5,000. We apologize for the late publishing of this week’s episode, but travel is back in season. Get ready for another candid episode with our usual pre-topic banter!

Recently, Balazs and I contributed to a running topic on Fratello about the best watches under €5,000. Articles like this always generate a fair amount of feedback, which we greatly appreciate. We discuss our picks, some of the feedback, and how the industry has changed. In particular, some of our favorite brands are now priced out of this all-important spending cap. Still, there are some fantastic new and used watches out there.

Kettle Kite

This week, we are coming to you from the Big Apple and the Big Smoke! Before getting to the Kettle Kite and our main topic of watches under €5,000, we talk about a recent Longines meetup in London. We also discuss how important face-to-face gatherings are to keep interest alive in vintage watches. Balazs is currently in the USA and will be for the next week. He’s wearing his faithful G-Shock (similar to but not exactly the model above). Mike is wearing a watch he has in for review, the Ollech & Wajs OW M-110 AS. It’s a great watch that we will feature soon enough on the site.

Our picks under €5,000

Next, we come to the main topic of our favorite watches under €5,000. Mike published his article first and chose pieces from Seiko, Breitling, Nomos, and Breguet. Balazs came with his article a couple of weeks later and chose entries from Grand Seiko, Ming, and Omega. He also threw in various vintage chronograph options. We discuss why we chose these models along with some of the comments we received. Finally, we discuss how brands like Omega and Rolex no longer play in this market if we are looking at retail prices. A lot has changed within the past several years indeed!

As always, thank you for listening! If you have any ideas for future shows, please feel free to let us know!

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Fratello On Air: Discussing Our Picks Under €5,000 And How The Industry Has Changed

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14 Comments

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Richard Warren says:

Oct 18, 2023 at 17:31

Great episode again, guys. This has quickly become my favorite podcast released by any watch website or blog. TGN is a close second. I appreciate your good natured discussions, and occasional sardonic take on certain watches, certain trends and certain comments in this article section(s).

The “Best watches under 5,000” has been a terrific series by Fratello, and so much fun to read. As for Balazs, I agree that it’s shocking that you can’t find an Omega under $5k these days. In 2021, I bought an Omega Seamaster Diver 300M (white dial) new, from a gray dealer, with box and papers, for $3,900 USD. That same watch is now listed at $5,900 on Omega’s website.

Mike – I agree with you regarding the Omega Railmaster. It’s a hugely underrated watch, and it’s sad that Omega discontinued it.

Reply
1. Mike Stockton says:
  
  Oct 19, 2023 at 09:34
  
  Thanks so much for listening!
  
  Reply
DK
Ayreonaut says:

Oct 18, 2023 at 18:20

I really like this podcast.

“Kettle Kite” makes no sense whatsoever, please stop saying it. I miss Handgelenks Kontrolle.

Reply
1. Mike Stockton says:
  
  Oct 19, 2023 at 09:29
  
  Well, we’ve anglicized it – perhaps you missed the explanation for the new name? A bit of cockney rhyming slang…admittedly, it’s still growing on us too and the Handgelenks Kontrolle may make a return…
  
  Reply
Pelandrone says:

Oct 18, 2023 at 19:34

5 large is a lot of dough…

incidentally, I received my 25% discounted Citizen Promaster Tough “Ray Mears edition” today, I haven’t been so exhilarated about a watch in quite a while, what a sweet little thing! Titanium, 300WR, eco drive, on-the-fly-adjustment-clasp, lume, large numerals, lovely.

Whoever told me about this particular reference – thank you again!

The titanium is not as white as on my Citizen AQ4091, I wonder how they whiten it.

Reply
1. MB
  MarkBu says:
  
  Oct 18, 2023 at 23:44
  
  If it’s the green-dialed one from Citizen UK, it was me, I think. Pleased to hear you’re enjoying it. They really are terrific little watches.
  
  Reply
  1. Pelandrone says:
    
    Oct 19, 2023 at 21:39
    
    cheers, thanks! 🙂
    
    Reply
2. Mike Stockton says:
  
  Oct 19, 2023 at 09:31
  
  The Ray Mears rocks! I wrote an article about it here several years ago after reading about it and then coincidentally seeing it on a friend’s wrist. One of my favorite watches…and now one of my Dad’s favorites too.
  
  Reply
  1. Pelandrone says:
    
    Oct 19, 2023 at 21:39
    
    read it, Mike, thank you!
    
    Reply
MB
MarkBu says:

Oct 18, 2023 at 20:20

The one take I have from the <£5k series is that nearly all my favorites in that price range would also appear in the <£3k one too. The law of diminishing returns looms large one you get above £3k, certainly in terms of the aspects I prioritize.

Reply
1. Mike Stockton says:
  
  Oct 19, 2023 at 09:32
  
  Agreed – although I might pierce the £3K barrier, I’d have plenty left over under the £5K limit…
  
  Reply
TickinTimeBaum says:

Oct 19, 2023 at 03:45

I haven’t yet had time to listen to the episode, and I’m not sure if this has already been addressed, and I don’t mean to say anyone’s wrong but intend to add a viewpoint:

“Finally, we discuss how brands like Omega and Rolex no longer play in this market if we are looking at retail prices. A lot has changed within the past several years indeed!”
-Is it that they have changed, or has the value of the € changed instead? Inflation means 5000€ isn’t worth what it used to be worth. Anyone keeping their pricing anywhere near constant in € will in fact be REDUCING their prices massively.

Reply
1. Mike Stockton says:
  
  Oct 19, 2023 at 09:34
  
  We didn’t discuss inflation and you have a fair point. My experience in watches (and frankly goods in general), though, is that few brands, if any, are apt to reduce prices when currencies fall or inflation cools off. However, they’re rather quick to react when trends are on the rise…
  
  Reply
Andrew says:

Oct 19, 2023 at 10:06

I’m my opinion, “how the industry has changed” is for the mainstream brands to be charging outrageous prices for what appear to have become Veblen goods. We’re now looking at steel watches being priced higher than 18k gold watches were in the past (even corrected for inflation) and with prices probably more than 20x what they actually cost to make.
It’s very sad for anyone who is interested in a watch for its craftsmanship rather than buying it as a status symbol. But alas, the market for status symbols has become so enormous that it now drives prices which have become totally disconnected from actual price of manufacture.
Thank goodness for microbrands as they are the only place where the status symbol purchasers are absent, and prices bear some relationship to cost of manufacture.
Please keep featuring microbrands and other non status symbol brands on this site as it’s about the only place where there is sanity away from the hype.

Reply